UK M&B Editors--Q&A Club

I'm so glad that this thread is here!  I can't tell you how many times in the last couple of years that I have logged onto it and found the answer to a question that I had myself. The editors and the pubbed authors who dropped by to respond were always helpful!

Here's an abstract question to start things out.  I have a gut feeling that something in the build-up to the dark moment of my Romance is not working.  I've looked at all the usual suspects:  plot, characterization, etc., but I can't pinpoint it so far.  Editors or pubbed authors, what do you do when you feel something is wrong with a manuscript but can't quite decide what it is?  How do you figure it out?  I've reread it several times already.  Should I take a walk?  Clean my house?  Reread the seventh Harry Potter?

Any advice would be welcome!

Shannon 

That's a hard one, Shannon. There can be so many reasons why something about a book isn't working. Sometimes the feeling that a particular aspect isn't right IS the problem, other times that's only a symptom and you have to dig around to figure out exactly what's amiss.

All Donna's suggestions are good ones. Ironing and scrubbing the bathrooms works for me . I also get lightbulb moments watching movies and Star Trek. 

Jennie 

It depends on gut feelings. Sometimes you are far too close.

I know that I have thought such and such was wrong, only to have the editors love it, and actually have problems with something else.

Sometimes, it can be far earlier in the text than you thought. She says have taken a wrong turning VERY early on the last one and this can make the black moment less dark. Have you not foreshadowed? Are you making things too easy too early/ Are you have your characters act out of character? have you settled something small and actually it needs to be some thing big? Have you madesure that your characters are out of their comfort zones? Have you forced them to patrol their boundaries, reset boundaries and finally get to the inner core? What will your characters settle for? Andwhy is this not enough?

As Donna said -- sometimes a new pair of eyes can spot the problem simply by asking a question and sending your mind in a totally different direction.

 AndIla, if you go on the M&B website http://www.millsand boon.co.uk, and click on contact and then find editors, you will get there.  Historicals ALWAYS seem to take a long time.

Michelle S

Not just historicals take a long time. I've had a Romance partial there since July. I'll just sit tight. The response will come when it comes.

I've found when something feels "off," it's usually the characters' emotions.  I haven't delved deeply enough into their point of view, and I haven't connected the emotional arc.  Check and see if you are tapping into your characters' feelings.  I've often found ways to solve the problem, simply by deepening the scene.  :)  Good luck!

Oh Carol....when I picture you I see you as the nice lady!  LOL  You don't seem the type to stomp and rage at all!  LOL

I tend to be too nice to my characters.  Or I try to develop the romance and then suck all the conflict out.  Sigh.

Thankfully I'm at the "nearly done" part of this ms so I don't have to worry much about that until I get to the start of the next, lol.

Donna

Hi everyone!

The lovely Dee emailed me to let me know this thread was back up and running. It is nice to see so many of you have found your way here too!

Wishing you all a belated Happy New Year!

Warm wishes

Joanne

*waves at Jo*

And your pic looks just fine.  :-)

Donna

Your pic looks ok to me too.

Nell x

Well, this isn't exactly related to my ms, but I am in an editing class this semester and have kind of an odd question---I usually use British English in my spelling and grammar, I know American English as well, the school I went to as a child accepted both forms and so I learned both.  My history teacher in middle school was Canadian---I was never discouraged from the British way until I got to college.  I prefer to use British spelling and grammar in my own writing and know from reading HH's that you all seem to stick with what the author uses, at least that is my impression.  So, is there some way to defend my use of British spelling and grammar to those who would want to force me to use American -- ex. colour vs. color or practise vs. practice.  If I was editing someone I can understand I'd want to stick with what they are using, so long as they are consistent and correct in whichever they are using----but I'm tired of people trying to make me use American----sorry, but 'defense' and 'center' just look WRONG to me.  

That one came up.  This is prob the wrong place to ask, but does anyone know why posts in other places (book reviews etc) don't show on your list of recent posts?   Also, the number of post apparently made seems to be stuck...

 Carol

You guys have made me blush 

The easiest way to let you know what new authors to look out for in 2008 is to share with you the list of new authors acquired in 2007 from Richmond. Here they are by series:

Historical 

Bronwyn Scott 

Kathryn Albright            

Sarah Mallory                

 Modern

Kate Hewitt                 

 Romance

Michelle Douglas         

Modern Heat

Robyn Grady                

Anna Cleary                    

Some may have had books out in the latter part of 2007, and there may be the odd author who debuted in the UK in 2007, but will be out for the first time in 2008 in NA, Historical author Deb Marlowe for example.

Have fun new author hunting! Actually, that sounds a little ominous, but you know what I mean... 

I'm thinking about entering the Instant Seduction competition as one of my target is Harlequin Presents.

But  I am wondering if Presents is open to multicultural or ethnic characters as heroines.

For instance, an italian hero and latino heroine or greek hero and african american heroine.

I don't recall reading any Presents with distinctively ethnic heroines such as Latin or Hispanic, African American, M/C or truely InterRacial. But I do know there are some Desires that have had multicultural or ethnic heroines. 

Are m/c heroines a no-no for Presents? I know the "all in the execution" line but I don't want to submit and get an no when I can redirect it to perhaps Desire or maybe Blaze? 

It is not a problem for any of the lines that I am aware of . It is just not an issue. The main thing is the romance and that is where your focus has to be. And you are far better off concentrating on personality conflicts rather than other sorts of conflicts. maek your romance strong and the editors will be happy.

It is all in the execution.

FWIW

Michelle S

Hi Joanne!

Looks like a great photo to me!  :)  Mine still has my head chopped off, but I can't figure out how to fix it.  Oh well.  I'll worry about it later.

Nice to see you in here.  :)

Candy,

I think if you ask any M&B author, they would say that to them, their characters are real people with flaws, family background etc. They have to be.  What goes on the page is simply the tip of the iceberg.  For example, I always know tons about my secondaries that will ever get on the page. I also know that 90% of the emotion I feel when I write my stories will not get through to the average reader.  So  when I am typing through tears, I hope to get a lump in the throat from readers. In other words H/Sil authors feel passionately about their characters, but do stay focused on the main spine of the book -- the romance.

A romance is an archplot format story. This means limited pov, strong spine, all subplots finished and the ending emotionally satisfying. In a romance, there is a  HEA because otherwise the story would not be emotionally satisfying.  A love story does not have to be an archplot (although this is the most commercially successful format in both movies and books) but would have the growth of emotional relationship as its central spine.

The other thing you need to remember is that category is short. Historical where I write has the most words to play with. BUT when the focus is on the growth of the emotional relationship between the two protagonists, you do not have many words left to explore vast cultural differences. You have to use a fine hand. Delicate shading if you will. And in some way it must further the main plot. But beyond that, if the romance is strong, you are fine.

 Michelle S

Hi Candy,

I think your questions has been answered quite fully already (thanks!), but just to reiterate, yes we are open to characters from all backgrounds in Presents and indeed in all our series.

I just want to pick up on one thing you mentioned though, you said 'I don't want to submit and get an no when I can redirect it to perhaps Desire or maybe Blaze?' It is the tone, themes etc that defines the series, so my advice would be target the line that you feel your submission fits best, based on your knowledge and research of the series.

I hope this helps and good luck with the writing!

Warm wishes

Joanne

See this is where we are going to differ - in my opinion a romance is also a love story or at least it should be. ANd I think a romance should be a love story because that brings in the heat and meat and so much more.

And  I don't know what you mean by "archplot format story". Formulaic? I'm confused by your wording and terminology.

As for the HEA, who says a love story will end in tragedy or won't have a HEA. That's also confusing to me. A love story and romance can have a HEA. And in my opinion, if a romance is just about sex and passion without adding in the emotional depth and growth that happens when people/characters fall in love then it's not a good read. A romance that does't contain the emotional relationship, development and growth, again in my opinion, only has card board characters. So maybe I misunderstood what you're trying to say, so if I did I apologize. 

And as  I mentioned it's not about exploring "vast cultural differences" but I'm not going to hide or gloss over something that will add to the story just because it may be seen as "taboo" or "too much". I don't think that will do the characters or the stories any justice. And as for any cultural differences if there are any, which there probably would be, I think it should add to the characters and their growth not become the focus.

Maybe I'm not explaining this right, but it also could be that in my experience when ever race or even racial differences come up, especially in romance things get icky and people assume that the story is going to be about the two races and fighting and prejudice and racism and that's not the case. My stories just happen to feature multi-cultural characters because that is what I see around me, it's what I live and it's what I write and promised myself I would right as a child.

Sorry if this post stepped on any toes or offended anyone but it is, what I thought to be, a legitimate question.  

Candy,

Can I offer one piece of advice -- Until you submit, no editor worth her red pen can tell you if such and such will not work. She actually has to see the work. Believe in your work and believe in yourself and your writing ability. Give it a chance and submit it. And yes, it is a risk.

If you are rejected, it will be for other reasons than the hero/heroine's skin colour, the time period or the location. You pen a strong enough romance that fits the guidelines of that line, they will buy it. The only people who know  for certain whether or not a particular story fits are the editors.

 It is as simple as that. I know. I have been there with time periods.

 The book they buy  may not be the first one you pen, Rejection  is part of the game, but so is learning, serving an appretenceship. It is all about your writing delivering on the promise they make to readers. Readers in over 109 different countries, 22 different languages who come in all shapes, sizes, creeds and skin tones.

 Dedication., determination, desire and discipline plus a healthy of dose of perservance are what is required in this business.

  But in order to truly know you have to submit.

When I first wrote Gladiator's Honour, a large number of people in the business including agents  told me that HM&B would never ever buy a romance set in Rome. Ever. I was wasting my time.

 These people were not the editors. Luckily I had the sense to ask a then editor about it. (She had plucked me off the slush pile after I submitted a Romance but I could not make it strong enough)  Her reply was if I wrote it, they would read it and make their decision.   I submitted my manuscript.  And eventually GH was bought, and it was the first Ancient Rome historical HM&B put out. And I have just turned in my 10th book for them. Ancient Rome has proved a viable time period -- even though I have branched out into other time periods.  BUT if I had listened to the naysayers, it would never have happened.

If you know your book is a little out of the ordinary, then all that means that it has to be that much stronger. It has to be a really compelling book. And if you get rejected, then you get even more determined to craft something brilliant.

Believe in your ability to write. Believe in your characters and submit.

For an explanation of archplot, I would recommend reading Robert McKee's  Story Substance,structure, style and the principles of screenwriting.. Although primarily written for the screenwriter, it is also very useful for any writer of commericial fiction. (I read it after I discovered my editors had been on his course)  It helps explain the basic building blocks of story telling.

And you are welcome to think of your stories in any way that you want, BUT the genre that HM&B publishes is ROMANCE and like a house has four walls and a roof, a door and windows, so ROMANCE has a few conventions. The conventions for the LOVE STORY genre are slightly different. Sorry if you felt confused. As I said, I submitted my 10th ms to my editors yesterday and may have been a bit unclear. I am talking about definitions for a genre. And the Romance genre is one of the most successful genres in publishing.

The take away from this post should be: if your story fits the guidelines, SUBMIT and see. Otherwise, you will never know.

And my fingers are crossed that some day I do get to welcome you to the HMB family of authors because you have penned this marvellous Presents which just so happens to have a heroine that you really believe in.

Michelle S

This is a question for Joanne--one she's probably tired of but . . . What's the current wait on a partial? Is 6-7 months average for a Romance line submission? 

Hi JoanneC,

This might make me sound like a muppet, but the email you just left, is it the same one that's on the M&B site and that used to be linked from this thread?

I only ask because I've been sending 6 weekly submission update emails since the five month mark via the M&B site and never got a response. I wondered if things had changed and I had been sending them to the wrong place. Oops.

Possibly confused you now, so apologies if I have. But thanks for leaving the email. I know where to direct them in future!

Allison 

Thank-you very much Joanne. I tried that website addie a while ago too and didn't get a confirmation email. I have done previously but it looks as though your site has been updated since last I used that service.

Btw the ref number had LF--not you, I think.

Lis, LF is Linda Fildew.  Just FYI.  And I'm glad you got your enquiry e-mail straightened out!  It's so hard when you think everything is out in the ether, isn't it.

Cheers,

Donna

P.S Jo do you ever get teased by your initials?  LOL  Talk about a God complex.....(sorry, it's Friday and I'm being silly)

Joanne, thank you so much!  I submitted back in August and sent an email back on Jan 14---but didn't get a response or a confirmation of the email, so I'll try it again.