"Shopping For The Alpha/Beta Hero" with Ellen Hartman & Jeannie Watt

Ellen?  Jeannie?  Anybody???  Echo, echo, echo...

Is everyone invisible?  Is it just me? <G>

I'm a beta hero fan myself.

*pant, pant*  Sorry for sliding in late.  There were the infamous technical difficulties, but all is well now. 

For those of you who don't know me, I'm Jeannie Watt and I write Superromances, but more about me later.  It’s hero writing time and we all know what we want in a hero.  He’s gotta  be strong and he’s gotta be fast...and he’s gotta be larger than life. 

 Or does he? 

Strong, yes.  Larger than life?  Sometimes a quiet guy who wants to make a difference and does the right thing, even when it’s difficult,  is just as sexy as the guy who has “hero” stamped on his tanned forehead above his piercing eyes.  A man who takes care of people can be as sexy as a man who runs a multi-billion dollar corporation—which is why Ellen and I are here this week.  We want to take a look at both the traditional and less traditional hero types.

To kick things off,  I’m going to give a brief overview of alpha and beta characteristics.  Alpha and beta personalities are sociological classifications, based loosely on the behavior of pack animals, such as wolves or herd animals such as horses.  (At my house, we have an alpha pony.  No one messes with him, even though he’s a foot shorter than the horses.  I guess he has short horse syndrome, because he’s very aggressive.  We have two betas, who’d really like to move into the alpha position, given a chance; a beta who’s fine just the way she is; and an omega, who longs to be a beta.) 

Back to the heroes: 

Why are alpha heroes popular?  Because they’re good at what they do.  Very good.  They’re the providers and the conquerors, the guys that take care of business. They can be charismatic, but have a tendency to be closed off, thus presenting a challenge.  An alpha is powerful and authoritative, aggressive and competitive.  He focuses on achievement, new conquests and results.  Does he ignore his feelings?  What feelings?  He’s too busy conquering the world to acknowledge feelings.    

What’s an alpha like once a woman manages to peel back the layers?  In real life there’s a good chance that he’s something of a jerk, because he denies all vulnerability and has no patience for the shortcomings of others.  Alphas tend to be ruthless and have a potential for belligerence—not the most endearing characteristics.  It’s our job as writers to add something more to these guys—vulnerabilities and deep emotions that they will eventually acknowledge before the story is over.  If they can’t do that, then they’re not hero material.   

Let’s move on the betas, a subject Ellen will be tackling in her post (thus allowing me to be brief).  Tom Hanks generally plays a beta character—the easy going guy who is delightfully human.  He is often a family man.  The dependable best friend.  The second in command. The beta has communication skills and is familiar with those things called “feelings”.  A beta is someone who can be counted on in a pinch, but who doesn’t try to obtain the top dog position through competition and aggressiveness.   Is he strong? Yes, but quietly so.  Is he boring?  He’d better not be, or we aren’t doing our job.  This is where I hand the baton to Ellen. 

Next the omega.  The omega is not a hero, but I am including the classification since the omega is often mistakenly called a beta.   No, no.  An omega is the low man on the totem pole.  He’s a wimp. The nerdiest of nerds, and I’m not talking the attractive kind of nerd.  He isn’t going to get the girl.  He’s Rick Moranis, the obnoxious accountant in Ghostbusters. Is he boring?  Probably, except for in those moments when he’s employed as comic relief.  Can he become less of a loser?  Yes, but it’ll take work, because the omega has serious flaws or he wouldn’t be where he is.  He may or may not be a lovable character. 

That’s the overview.  I’ll be back later in the day to add a few more thoughts, but for now, if you’d like to comment, and I’d love it if you would,  tell me your feelings on alphas and betas.    As a writer, which type do you generally write, and as a reader what type do you gravitate toward? And finally, do you have any good examples of alpha, beta or omega characters (from books, movies or TV)?  I’m making a list for future reference and would love to have some suggestions.  

Oh, and as an incentive, I'm giving away two copies of Cowboy Comes Back, which you will hear about later, on Friday in a random drawing.

See you in a bit, 

Jeannie

Hello Susan Gable, Queen of the Awesome Beta Hero!  It's great to see you here. 

Sam--Great question about the lines and I love your heroes, too.  The one that really sticks in my mind is that wonderful cowboy hunk in Pick Me Up.  Sexy and low key.  *sigh*  Of course, I think I'm going to really love Jarod in Hard To Resist, which I will finish as soon as my manuscript is turned in.

Back to the question (and thank you!), readers are obviously loyal to certain lines because they are drawn to a certain type of hero.  They know that in a Presents they are guaranteed both an alpha hero and an HEA.  The same with Desires.  Certain type of hero guaranteed.  That kind of fits the definition of a stereotype, so the trick is to take the stereotypical alpha hero and flip him a little so he's not a cardboard cut out.  Find an interesting way to give the alpha enough pain to make him acknowledge his feelings.  Give him an interesting vulnerability, but one that meshes with his macho nature. 

With betas I think there is more freedom from stereotyping, since I think that personality type encompasses a broader range of characteristics.  You can give a beta more interesting vulnerabilities, like being afraid of spiders, since they don't have to maintain the macho image in order to dominate the world.  There is a beta stereotype floating around, but I personally think a lot of it is off base, and again, that omegas are being mistakenly identified as betas.

A gamma is a combined alpha and beta and probably the least likely to be stereotyped.  Since personality types can change--a beta can become alpha, or develop latent alpha characteristics, due to a conscious choice or due to circumstances, just as an alpha can tamp down some of his alpha-ness and become more beta-ish--so a gamma is probably the result of a transformation.  One particular gamma developing scenario I love is common in comic book heroes (and in Mad Max and Brave Heart).  Regular guys develop alpha characteristics (lying dormant within them, no doubt) due to a traumatic life event.  The result--a fascinating hero. 

Of course my favorite lines are Superromances and Blaze because the heroes and heroines come in all kinds of packages. Readers read these line for the themes--sensuality in the Blazes and the family connection in Supers.  Therefore our heroes are allowed more quirks, shall we say?  I love being able to write a betaish beta one time and an alphaism beta the next time.

Thanks for the question,

Jeannie

(Apologies for the flurry of posting. I have to get this up quick before my lunch break is over. After this I'll behave.)

I agree with pretty much everything Jeannie said in her overview of the beta hero. He’s easy-going, delightfully human, and a guy you can depend on. I don’t agree that he's destined to be the second-in-command,  but I absolutely do think when the beta guy is in charge his leadership style is different than the alpha’s style.

I saw a comment a few weeks ago from someone who said she’d love to have "one of those beta heroes" come by and make her dinner. She sees a beta differently than I do. I’ve read alphas who can cook and I’ve never written a beta who can, so I’m not buying that skills define the man. The difference is richer and deeper than whether the guy is more comfortable ordering a pizza or julienning a carrot.

What does define the beta hero?

A beta hero’s psychology is wired differently than an alpha. His actions, his response to conflict, his emotional life, and his personal style make him different.

For me, a beta:

• Listens more.
• Has a rich emotional life.
• Is willing to ask more often than he orders.
• Is lower on the possessive scale and higher on the treasuring scale.
• Apologizes when he's wrong (sometimes).
• Is able to change course more easily than an alpha.
• Is flexible and responsive even if he gets tripped up by an inability to communicate the same as many men.

Beta heroes you may know

I have to start with the caveat that for me, identifying hero types is one of those “I know ‘em when I see ‘em” questions. We’re never going to have a cut and dried list of guys everyone sees the same way. But I’m putting a few down here on the chance examples will help. (I’m including one of mine  because he’s the one I’m most qualified to discuss in detail. I wrote him, so I know how he ticks.)

1. Ponyboy Curtis (from The Outsiders by S.E. Hinton). Contrast him with his alpha brother, Darry.
2. Devin MacKade (from The Heart of Devin MacKade by Nora Roberts). A beta sheriff! Best of both worlds.
3. Colin Bridgerton (from Romancing Mr. Bridgerton by Julia Quinn). Historical beta. Also with bonus alpha brothers.
4. Phin Tucker (from Welcome to Temptation by Jennifer Crusie). I’d argue that Phin’s delightful brother-in-law Davy Dempsey is also a beta. We can discus if anyone wants to.
5. Brett Bishop (from The Brother Returns by Jeannie Watt). I fell in love in his first scene when he’s afraid of the snake that might crawl up his pants, but he takes care of it anyway.
6. Mason Star (from His Secret Past by Ellen Hartman). Proof that a rock star can be a beta guy.
7. Last, but never least, one of the most famous betas: Atticus Finch (from To Kill a Mockingbird).

Why do we love a beta?

Again, this is subjective, and each hero has his own lovable qualities. I took a stab at outlining some of the characteristics of a beta hero above and those are definitely some of the reasons a beta is lovable.

In my opinion, the number one sexiest, most attractive thing about a beta is the part in the story when he’s pushed to his limit, draws a line in the sand, and defends his relationship, family, or heroine. Nothing, I repeat nothing, is more thrilling to me than to see one of these usually flexible, reasonable guys flat out refuse to bend. When they reach their limit and they stick…swoon. I love it.

I also think a beta has capacity to be surprised by the heroine and then to give her room to play. Because he's not quite as concerned about being in charge, there is more give and take.  (I think this is true in beta sex scenes as well.)

Questions?

So, does anybody have questions about who a beta hero is? Anybody want to discuss famous betas? Have a question about your own heroes?

Ellen

First of all, I want to correct something I said that Ellen picked up on--I didn't mean that a beta was destined to be second in command, only that they often fill this role.  There are many betas in leadership roles, and in fact, betas are probably more effective leaders because they don't have to vanquish all rivals.  Sorry for the misinformation. 

Hi Tappitytaptap--Originally, I wasn't going to mention gammas at all (and you'll notice that my first post had no gamma) for the sake of simplicity.  I didn't want to expound on too many classification types.  To me, gammas are guys who've come to a place where they can tap into both sets of resources--alpha and beta--comfortably.  007 to me is still alpha.  He hasn't gained enough confidence in his emotions to be gamma.  When push comes to shove, he's going to resort to his alpha resources and muscle his way through a situation (vanquishing all enemies--even ones he may kind of like, or have made love to).  A true gamma, to me, would utilize more emotions and feelings.

Goose in Top Gun is beta.  He's comfortable with his emotions.  And (thank you), you've accidentally hit on a common misconception--that betas can't be strong.  Betas are strong--they simply aren't as blatant in their displays of strengths.  All of my beta heroes are darned tough men (cowboys, cops), but they're quiet about it.

As Sam said, when writing for a certain line, an author must keep in mind the general characteristics the line requires, but I wouldn't get hung up on the name.  The Presents hero must be strong and ruthless (in a heroic sort of way) and aggressive, which are alpha characteristics.  But he might secretly support an orphanage, due to his past, which is a beta thing.  We don't have to classify him as a gamma because of that and say he won't do as a Presents hero, but instead know that we added a layer of depth to our alpha guy. 

You won't see a lanky beach combing writer as the hero of a Presents, but make him a powerful businessman who gets headaches and only finds solace while walking the beach (though he may not yet know why) and you have an alpha with a vulnerability.  Is he really a gamma, once he comes to understand why he gets the headaches or why the beach soothes him?  Maybe.  But I prefer to think of him as an alpha who's gotten in touch with his inner beta.

Clear as mud?

Jeannie 

Okay, I'll leave gammas behind & laser focus on alpha's & beta's. 

you have an alpha with a vulnerability.

So, with his flexiblility & somewhat enhanced male communication skills, added to vulnerability (which can be all sorts of things), plus snips & snails & puppy dog tails, that's what makes a beta a beta? 

Hmmmm...  would a beta be something of an alpha with an achilles heel? Does his intenal conflict that the heroine brings out also bring forth latent alpha qualities, as when Ellen said he refuses to bend at a particular point? Am I making everything even muddier? I think what confuses me is the sharing of qualities. Alphas would be like 99% A, with 1%B, while Betas would be ... what? 25/75?

Popping in quick to address Tappitytaptap's comment: Hmmmm...  would a beta be something of an alpha with an achilles heel? Does his intenal conflict that the heroine brings out also bring forth latent alpha qualities, as when Ellen said he refuses to bend at a particular point?

I'm interested in Ellen's take on this question.  She really knows her heroes and she describes betas so well.

Personally, I think an alpha with an achilles heel is an alpha, unless he's able to see other people's point of view and not be so demanding because of it.  Now the heroine bringing out the latent alpha in a beta is interesting.  I think as far as protecting and providing, yes, that's true.  It also works the other way around with the heroine bringing out the alpha's vulnerabilities and forcing him to deal with them.

I think your comment about betas being 75%B and 25%A is excellent.  I'd never thought of it that way, but yeah, I think that's what a good beta is.  He has the strength, but doesn't have to flaunt it.  He has to be pushed to the point where he says, "No more."  This happened in Susan Gable's first book, The Baby Plan.  Her hero's brothers pushed him, pushed him, and finally he'd had enough and had to punch one.  He did a good job of it, too.

Nancy--interesting description of a gamma.  Back in 1997, author Deb Stover came up with the term, which she used to describe her heroes.  Her definition--"One who doesn't fit the image of the macho Alpha male, or the easygoing Beta either. He's a combination--a mutation?--of both types of man, and makes a hero to die for."  Suggested males that fit the type were Sean Connery, Mel Gibson and Tom Selleck (remember, this was 1997).  Apparently the definition has expanded and changed.  Interesting

I'm glad to hear that the alphas in Desires and Presents are allowed a softer side.  That would make them much more desireable to me.  I like a guy who can laugh at himself.  Can alphas do that?  I need an answer from a Desires reader.  Anyone?

I'll be back in a couple hours.  Thanks everyone for your comments.

Jeannie

Thanks for the great info. What do you do with your heros to keep them engaged through the middle of the book? Do Beta heros have different needs than alpha ones to sustain them through the middle? 

I have to admit that when Dee came up with the intro text for our Q&A, I told Jeannie I don't know much about hero archetypes. I know how to write a beta who works as a romantic hero, but parsing the differences between alpha, beta, and any other types makes my head hurt. Jeannie swore we'd do this intro on the first day where we talked about the types and then get to the juicy stuff. (This is why she wrote the post with all the types mentioned and let me focus just on the beta guys. Jeannie's nice like that. )

I don't see much cross-over between alphas and betas, actually. I think the psychology and instinct that makes a man (or a woman) an alpha is hard to overcome, especially in high tension situations like, for example, the climax of a romance. In my opinion, an alpha is hard wired to protect, to possess, to compete, and to win. Those can be sexy traits, which makes those guys popular hero types

On the other hand, a beta guy who is confronted with a high tension situation is going to react differently. He might be boiling over with frustration and be on the verge of pounding heads, but I think he's almost always going to ask a question or two and check his assumptions. The instinct to protect and defend is always there--he's a hero, after all, but it's tempered by other factors. He's perfectly capable of pounding heads, but the reason he does it is different than an alpha's reason. When the beta makes his stand, he's almost always doing it because he believes it's the right thing to do. His motivation may be less about winning and more about justice.

Anyway, as Jeannie said, it's not important to identify exactly which type of guy you're writing as long as he fits the line you're targeting and he's a great character. That stuff, how to write a beta guy who is a great character, is what I'm eager to discuss!

Ellen  

Marcie--I had no idea what kind of hero I was writing, either.  I wrote a guy I could fall in love with. He wasn't alpha. 

 Did you know that there is a self-help book called Alpha Male Syndrome, in which the authors (two alphas themselves--married by the way) try to help Alphas tone down their behavior and learn how to deal with situations in a less alpha and more constructive way.  The authors mention that sometimes beleagured colleagues are actually the people who read the book, in an attempt to understand and protect themself from the alpha male.  Alphas do not like the concept of self-help (unless they get hit over the head with a figurative frying pan--which I guess is what happened to the authors.)

I'll be back tomorrow morning, when we'll dive into writing the beta.

Have a good evening,

Jeannie

Hi Kathleen,

I'm going to hope that Jeannie (or someone) will jump in an answer your question, because I honestly don't know. I really love my betas so I don't tend to read many alpha heroes. I did recently read an SSE with an alpha hero and he was pretty alpha, but I could see that he was also toned down a little bit. 

In Desires, the point of view isn't shared equally, is it? That may also affect the expectations for the characters. If the book is mainly from the heroine's point of view, the alpha male won't have to exlain his motivations as often or as intimately.

Sorry that I don't know more about the alphas in other lines. I hope someone else can offer some info! 

Ellen 

I think what you're describing is similar to the difference I saw in the alpha in the SSE I read last week. The hero was controlling and overbearing, but he knew it and tried to deal with it. I still had trouble with some of his actions, but the self-awareness made him seem a bit less alpha.

Thanks for jumping in with your info!

Ellen

Hi Chrissie Sue,

I'm so glad you found the conflct Q&A to be helpful. I had a terrific time that week. I'm feeling a lot of the same energy here. 

The "man cave" I mentioned is when a beta hero retreats from his more evolved emotional responses and tries to wall himself off. He may leave town or move into his office or stop talking about anything except work--anything he can think of to prevent further pain. I think what's interesting about this reaction in a beta hero is that it doesn't work. These guys can't ignore their feelings and eventually they have to deal with them. When they come back from their "retreat" usually their emotions are running high and there's an explosion: a fist fight (with another guy), amazing sex (with the heroine), some over-the-top gesture to prove their point. 

In Romancing Mr. Bridgerton, by Julia Quinn, Colin Bridgerton marries Penelope Featherington. Colin has a problem, though, he's jealous of Penelope's career as a gossip columnist. More than that, he feels useless because he doesn't have any work of his own. After they marry, their lives are pretty near perfect, except that Colin closes off this one part of his life to himself and to Penelope. 

He doesn't retreat physically, but he does emotionally. He won't talk about her work or his writing or anything related to those topics. Penelope is hurt. Colin feels like an enormous jerk. Things are going badly and they both try to ignore it. Finally, he realizes he needs to deal with these emotions which opens the door to a fulfilling life with the woman he loves. 

Basically, the hero does a one step forward, two steps back kind of dance. He has emotions and knows he needs to deal with them but it's too hard or scary or unpredictable so he does his best to turn them off. Lucky for us, that only serves to raise the tension!

Ellen

Hi Ellen,

This is so interesting. I'm really enjoying the discussion.

My question is about showing my hero's guy-side. He's a loner and is at odds with his half brother (they come to an uneasy, new truce but not up to banter) and hasn't had the chance to make guy friends in town.

Are there any other ways I can show this?

He has a pre-teen son. I've tried to get him to be 'manly' with him. Could that work?

Thanks, Bec

I just wrote a long post and lost it because I have this cool mouse with a little button on the side that sends you back to the webpage you just left.  Not too much fun when you don't want to go there and you've just written a good sized post. 

So....one more time, then I will be hitting the manuscript.

Ellen--I love that the beta is a hero first, a man second and a beta third.  This reminds me of when I was working in the mine a long time ago.  There weren't many women (4 of us, 300 guys).  My goal was to be seen as a worker first and a woman second--which can be difficult in a situation like this.  I knew I'd accomplished my goal when my shift boss had to call maintenance because "one of his guys' lights wasn't working."  I was the guy!

Jax--Thanks for telling us about the Modern Heat hero.  I've only read one Modern Heat, since they aren't easy to find here, and the hero was alphaish in his work, but definitely softer with the heroine.  Interesting.  And good luck with your submission.  If you can write a great hero, then you are well on your way.

Chrissie Sue--Good to see you here.  Chrissis and I met on eharl, then discovered we're both from northern Nevada, where living 200 miles apart makes you neighbors.  We now belong to the same romance writers groupl.  Chrissie--as to your question, I think that your hero has been in the man cave, trying to avoid his feelings rather than deal with them.  When his friend helps him see the light, he leaves the cave.  Alphas spend a lot of time in the cave, and continue to do so for the rest of their lives. It's one of their coping skills. Betas aren't comfortable in the cave.  They got there for the same reason as the alphas, but they can't bury things deep enough to never deal with them.  I love Ellen's Julia Quinn example.  I must look into that book.

Kathleen--I haven't read that many alpha heroes in Supers.  I think it's like Ellen said, since we write half the book in the hero's poiint of view, we dig into their feelings.  I don't think the very, very alpha guy would fly in a Super because the arrogance would keep him from changing.  He would work if he did change.  In fact, that could be a very cool book.  Kind of like Taming of the Shrew backwards.

I'll pop back in in a couple hours and see what's shaking.  I'm hoping to see lots of questions.

Jeannie  (pushing "post"quickly, so as not to lose this post)

Jeannie, you get me thinking right back, as always. :)

I guess I don't know that I agree with that point about Alphas, that they can't empathize when they aren't leading... I think that's only true when you have a limited or undeveloped Alpha... I mean I think the leader of a Navy Seals unit, for instance, will do whatever is best for his unit -- including step aside if he has to**.The Chief of Police or the Captain has to be able to think about all of his cops, all the time -- if anything, they are intense empathizers to be able to do that, and make it work.

Their focus is often more on others than on themselves. In fact, they are very likely to sacrifice themselves for the group, IMO, because if they have any fault, it could be empathizing too much, and taking on too much of the responsibility rather than letting others do it.  This fault is one that can seem like it's being ignorant or insensitive to the capability of others, when it's really taking on too much, caring too much. I think this could be the more "heroic" formula of the Alpha. 

The egocentric, limited Alpha would be the one I would see as the bad guy, the potentially abusive guy because he has no perspective -- he/she can't let go of control, they must control at all costs, with little thought to others. Which is intrinsically non-heroic.

IMO, not knowing your son too well, it sounds like he's probably more of a Gamma, a blend. An alpha would be driven to lead and work their way to the top. Your son is very much like I described a beta above in my previous post -- but his protective instincts, his Alpha emerges when it needs to, but being at the head of the pack is not what's most important to him.

But in all fairness, I don't think Alphas want to lead completely based on ego either -- I think it's because it's intrinsic -- it's what they are more or less born to do, and they are good at it. My husband is a total Alpha -- I have no doubt on that score -- but he's also artistic and can hold a conversation and reads, and is a sensitive guy who can often think emotional matters through better than I can. So I think we have to be careful of interpreting the Alpha too narrowly...

Sam

** Adding, I think Suz Brockmann actually has this happen in her books, Navy Seals -- all Alphas, but they will step aside if they think that's what's best. It's not easy for them, but they are driven to do what's best for others, since that's what good leadership is all about, really...

Hi Bec!

Good to see you here. Your hero sounds like my kind of guy. Wounded, loner, at odds with his family, single dad. Sign me up for a copy of that!

There are tons of ways to get your beta guy to show off his masculine side. I think you may have a good opportunity with the pre-teen son. In my first Super, the hero, Nathan is a writer, but he is also an ex-basketball star. The heroine's ten-year-old is looking for instruction in the art of the hook shot and Nathan is on hand to dispense it. He also installs the basketball hoop and backboard--working with tools is a great way to show the "guy" side. Maybe your hero and the son can cultivate a hobby or interest.

I also like to see beta heroes interact with kids. I like the dynamic where they know the child's feelings are important and they want to provide guidance, but they may not be exactly sure what to say or how to say it. They may express emotion but be embarrassed by it at the same time. Or the guy can see that the kid is embarrassed and do something to ease the situation like looking away or pulling the child into a hug where he can discreetly wipe his tears away on the hero's t-shirt.  

Then there are all the external ways to reinforce a character's masculine side: cars, home environment, wardrobe, etc.

I'm at work now (on lunch break), so I don't have my books to look for specific references. Off the top of my head, I know Phin Tucker (Welcome to Tempation) plays pool. In my next Super, Charlie McNulty is a poker genius.

Maybe Jeannie has some ideas for specifics here, too.

Ellen 

I find the defense of alphas often changes the definition of alphas to conform to what the defender wants to defend.  A lot of Presents heros are downright nasty when they think they are right, even when they are wrong.  They are always perfectly apologetic when they get proved wrong, but they are obnoxious before and I would assume afterwards, when the glow has worn off.  I'm thinking of a real book and a real online read that, if I had been in either heroine's position, I would have filed a complaint against the "hero" with the police for stalking or assault. Even Betty Neels heros can be quite nasty when they want to be.  With words not blows. Words that they can never take back, but the heroine always forgives them.

It sounds as if you and I might make a companionable book club.

Ellen

P.S. Jeannie--you're so funny. Back away from the alpha...hee! 

What comes to mind more, for me, is line specificness -- it's not just that we do what's convenient for us personally, but each line has it's own set of values and a belief system of sorts (which is why certain readers are attracted to certain kinds of character dynamics within each line).

I consider myself a writer of Alphas, primarily, but for Blaze that means something so different than for Presents -- and I consider many of my heroines to be Alphas as well, because strong men often need/attract strong women (and visa versa). I love that dynamic, that you can have two incredibly powerful people, and they will either bounce off of each other in a negative way, or hone each other in an "iron sharpens iron" kind of way -- make each other the best they can be. 

Context is incredibly important, as is genre. The Presents Alpha cannot be the Blaze Alpha. And the Blaze Alpha, in general is a much more developed man, really what I consider the best possible combination of traits (which would explain why I enjoy writing them so much). The "Die Hard" or "Terminator" action-movie Alpha is not the romance Alpha, etc. 

To Ellen's point on betas, I love betas, having spent a good deal of time around academic men who largely filled that mental coffer for me. But while we can quickly point out what are some of the limitations/challenges an Alpha must face and grow through,  what are beta limitations? What are the shortcomings and short-sightednesses that Beta men/heroes often have to get over? Just sayin'... ;)  and a good hero does have to have some shortcomings, right?

Sam

Darn, Sam.  That's a good question about what the betas have to over come.  I'm plugging into thinking mode.  One thing some betas have to overcome is a feeling of inadequacy.  Nathan, the newspaper guy in the book I'm working on now, has lived in his brothers' shadows for his entire life, and the one time he did investigative reporting, he got blown up.  Now he has to come to terms with both his injury and his sense that he's not as dynamic as his brothers.  He is, but in a different way, and that is what he comes to realize.

You're so right about the stereotyping, which is what this Q&A is ultimately about--sidestepping the stereotype.

I love your beta guy and alpha woman--one of my favorite scenarios.  I bet your beta is pretty good with his slide rule, isn't he?

Jeannie (signing off for a couple of revision hours) 

Keep those questions and comments coming.

What you described, Danielita, is a hero.  And he sounds like a hot one.  Sometimes it's too hard to classify these things and the best thing to do is to just write a guy you could fall in love with, because readers need to fall in love with heroes.

As to the trauma being stereotypical--it's all in the execution.  Most people by a certain age have encountered some trauma in their lives and it shapes them.  The hates-all-women-because-his-fiancee-dumped-him/mother-abandoned-him/wife-slept-with-best-friend is stereotypical because it's over the top and over done.  But one of those could be a partial motivation when layered in with other motivations for a guy to have deep trust issues.  Motivation is rarely simple and if it is, then we get into stereotype territory.

Hope this helps,

Jeannie

Very, very interesting conversation. My question is about alphas and internal conflict. How can an alpha remain an alpha (which I define as strong, self-assured, and determined) and have internal conflict about romantic involvement? Shouldn't he know what he wants when he sees it? Even if he cannot say "Love," shouldn't he be fearless about his desires for a specific woman and sure of his need to possess her?

I second Bec's question. 

And thanks ladies for answering my other one.

Marcie

Sorry, still cogitating on this, but I think my Alpha Texas Ranger is far more sensitive and able to deal with situations because he has seen more in life -- he's suffered, he's lost -- he *knows.*

My beta science genius, while a great guy, has led a more sheltered existence, and so his frame of reference for relating to people is more limited. He is sensitive to the heroine because he loves her and he knows her. He's a wonderful man, but he wouldn't have known what to do with the heroine from the July book (the Texas Ranger) or her situation -- he would not have had the emotional range or the ability to deal with her or her problems.

Sam